The Next U.S. President

Discussions of things currently in the news.

The Next U.S. President

Postby Lance » Sun Feb 28, 2016 3:23 pm

How much do you non-USAans pay attention to our current (joke of a) presidential race?

And if you had a vote, who would you pick?
No trees were killed in the posting of this message.
However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

==========================================

Build a man a fire and he will be warm for a few hours.
Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
User avatar
Lance
Administrator
Administrator
Cheeseburger Swilling Lard-Ass who needs to put down the remote and get off the couch.
 
Posts: 91394
Joined: Thu May 12, 2005 5:51 pm
Location: Oswego, IL

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Lianachan » Sun Feb 28, 2016 4:56 pm

Image
A-nis bidh fios aig daoine nuair a tha mi a 'mionnachadh aig dhaibh.
User avatar
Lianachan
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
Tits and Nazis though.... Worth investigating
 
Posts: 8742
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 5:12 pm
Location: A' Ghàidhealtachd, Alba

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Lance » Sun Feb 28, 2016 5:55 pm

And, let's all welcome our new smiley!

It is on the last page of smilies or you can add it manually using:
Code: Select all
:gaf:


:gaf:
No trees were killed in the posting of this message.
However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

==========================================

Build a man a fire and he will be warm for a few hours.
Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
User avatar
Lance
Administrator
Administrator
Cheeseburger Swilling Lard-Ass who needs to put down the remote and get off the couch.
 
Posts: 91394
Joined: Thu May 12, 2005 5:51 pm
Location: Oswego, IL

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Arneb » Sun Feb 28, 2016 6:22 pm

Considering that US Presidents have a rather large foorprint in the world (just ask people torn to shreds in a drone attack or held in GITMO, both without without charge, hearing, habeas corpus or appeal), no-one can afford to be totally disinterested.

All the GOP candidates give me the creeps, Ted Cruz even more than The Donald. None would be up to the challenges of a world more and more committed, to strife, adversity, cutback of trade, and fear of complexity - they would make all those trends worse. Bernie Sanders just doesn't seem to be viable - Someone who calls himself as Socialist as an American President (viewed from here, he'd be a centrist run-of-the-mill Social Democrat and nothing out of the ordinary. But there's labels for you)isjust not something I can imagine, and he'd probably be greeted by bazooka fire once he set foot in Congress.

So yeah, it's Hillary for me. A slick, unprincipled, dealmaking, two-faced politician archetype is probably not theworst choice when the world is full of Taliban types, and I subsume the Cruz/Rubio/Carson gang among those. My fear is that Americans will choose someone from the GOP looney bin just because Hillary seems so damn entitled and unavoidable.
Non sunt multiplicanda entia praeter necessitatem
User avatar
Arneb
Moderator
Moderator
German Medical Dude
God of All Things IT
 
Posts: 70001
Joined: Thu Nov 23, 2006 8:22 pm
Location: Potsdam, Germany

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Heid the Ba » Sun Feb 28, 2016 9:42 pm

What Arneb said.
Get it up ye.
User avatar
Heid the Ba
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
Tree hugging, veggie, sandal wearing, pinko Euroweasel
Mr. Sexy Ass
 
Posts: 107530
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:20 pm
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Lianachan » Sun Feb 28, 2016 10:24 pm

I appreciate that whoever is the next president will be globally significant, I just don't give a fuck because I don't think it matters who it actually is.
A-nis bidh fios aig daoine nuair a tha mi a 'mionnachadh aig dhaibh.
User avatar
Lianachan
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
Tits and Nazis though.... Worth investigating
 
Posts: 8742
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 5:12 pm
Location: A' Ghàidhealtachd, Alba

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Lance » Mon Feb 29, 2016 2:52 am

I think it will matter to some degree. They're all fuck shit up, but different choices will fuck up different things.
No trees were killed in the posting of this message.
However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

==========================================

Build a man a fire and he will be warm for a few hours.
Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
User avatar
Lance
Administrator
Administrator
Cheeseburger Swilling Lard-Ass who needs to put down the remote and get off the couch.
 
Posts: 91394
Joined: Thu May 12, 2005 5:51 pm
Location: Oswego, IL

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Мастер » Mon Feb 29, 2016 4:03 am

Lance wrote:How much do you non-USAans pay attention to our current (joke of a) presidential race?


The choice of the next global dictator is very much a topic of discussion, pretty much on a daily basis. The last issue of The Economist had an "Uncle Sam" picture with Donald Trump's face, and the caption, "Really?"

Lance wrote:And if you had a vote, who would you pick?


I would be for whichever candidate would commit the least amount of terrorism, if I could figure out who that is. Unlike those of us living in colonies (rebellious or obedient), I imagine members of the ruling class would probably consider other criteria, like who is going to give them the most candy.
They call me Mr Celsius!
User avatar
Мастер
Moderator
Moderator
Злой Мудак
Mauerspecht
 
Posts: 23929
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:56 pm
Location: Far from Damascus

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Мастер » Mon Feb 29, 2016 4:04 am

Arneb wrote:Considering that US Presidents have a rather large foorprint in the world (just ask people torn to shreds in a drone attack or held in GITMO, both without without charge, hearing, habeas corpus or appeal), no-one can afford to be totally disinterested.


Yes, the "War on Terrorism" probably hasn't killed 1,000 times as many innocent civilians as the original "terror", although it is getting close by some counts.
They call me Mr Celsius!
User avatar
Мастер
Moderator
Moderator
Злой Мудак
Mauerspecht
 
Posts: 23929
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:56 pm
Location: Far from Damascus

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Arneb » Mon Feb 29, 2016 7:55 am

Lianachan wrote:I appreciate that whoever is the next president will be globally significant, I just don't give a fuck because I don't think it matters who it actually is.

I have my doubts about that. I think Cruz or the Donald would be actively destructive even towards what Mactep calls the "obedient" colonies, and they would work hard to actively hollow out what the U.S. wants to stand for. While I do get the impression that Bernie cares about American values, while Hillary accepts them as long as they don't stand in her way.

Things that make some small progress and bring small improvements like Iran nuclear arms deal, the recent thawing in Cuba relations, or any old free trade agreement will become well-nigh impossible with GOP looneys.
Non sunt multiplicanda entia praeter necessitatem
User avatar
Arneb
Moderator
Moderator
German Medical Dude
God of All Things IT
 
Posts: 70001
Joined: Thu Nov 23, 2006 8:22 pm
Location: Potsdam, Germany

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Heid the Ba » Mon Feb 29, 2016 8:58 am

I think Clinton is the best of a bad lot. Cruz or Trump would be actively harmful to the US and the RoW, Clinton would only be passively harmful. The problem is that Cruz and particularly Trump have moved things so far off the normal scale that Clinton (a woman!) will either be hamstrung or have to pander to the nutters.

I'm afraid that the US seems to be regressing when everyone else is moving forwards.
Get it up ye.
User avatar
Heid the Ba
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
Tree hugging, veggie, sandal wearing, pinko Euroweasel
Mr. Sexy Ass
 
Posts: 107530
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:20 pm
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Мастер » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:15 am

Heid the Ba' wrote:I think Clinton is the best of a bad lot. Cruz or Trump would be actively harmful to the US and the RoW, Clinton would only be passively harmful. The problem is that Cruz and particularly Trump have moved things so far off the normal scale that Clinton (a woman!) will either be hamstrung or have to pander to the nutters.


I saw somewhere the analysis that argued that the next global dictator will be the first woman, Hispanic, Jew, or Trump to hold the office.

Heid the Ba' wrote:I'm afraid that the US seems to be regressing when everyone else is moving forwards.


I'd be OK with the US moving in whatever direction it feels like moving in, if it would learn where its borders are.

Bernie Sanders - not sure where he stands on US terrorism, but regarding his economic policies I hear a lot of Scandinavian politicians distancing themselves from him (e.g., we have a market economy in Denmark).

Clinton - card-carrying member of the "it's not terrorism when we do it" club. Would continue the fight against "extremists" and "terrorists", defined as anyone who opposes or criticises US policy, anyone the US thinks might have opposed or criticised its policy in the past, or who may do so in the future, anyone who looks like someone who opposes or criticises US policy, anyone standing in next to any person in one of the previous characters, anyone dining in the same restaurant as someone in the previous categories, anyone riding on the same bus as anyone in the previous categories, anyone living in the same town as anyone in the previous categories, etc.

Trump - anyone remember Germany in the 1930s?

Cruz - born in Canada, so should worry that the Canadians might impose a retaliatory embargo forcing all banks everywhere in the world to refuse to deal with people who are, have been, look like, smell like, etc., Canadians, to match the US anti-freedom embargo. Possible would therefore preside over the US invasion of Canada, whose liberation may or may not go better than the liberation of Iraq. (There is precedent for that - the US declared war on the UK in 1812 over extra-territorial jurisdiction. Only the global dictatorship in Washington has the right to impose its laws on the entire world, not some group of pretenders in Westminster.) Might have to wear a yellow maple leaf if Trump wins.
They call me Mr Celsius!
User avatar
Мастер
Moderator
Moderator
Злой Мудак
Mauerspecht
 
Posts: 23929
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:56 pm
Location: Far from Damascus

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby tubeswell » Mon Feb 29, 2016 12:42 pm

Trump gets stuck into China, Japan, India, Mexico etc for taking advantage of the USA in the TPP

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/201 ... e_tpp.html
A bus station is where a bus stops. A train station is where a train stops. On my desk, I have a work station.

If you are seeing an apparent paradox, that means you are missing something.
User avatar
tubeswell
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
 
Posts: 324860
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2010 11:51 am
Location: 129th in-line to the Llama Throne (after the last purge)

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Lance » Mon Feb 29, 2016 2:47 pm

I think the idea of democracy never took large groups of stupid people into account. It's ironic that the majority of the GOP base are the same people most hurt by conservative policies.
No trees were killed in the posting of this message.
However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

==========================================

Build a man a fire and he will be warm for a few hours.
Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
User avatar
Lance
Administrator
Administrator
Cheeseburger Swilling Lard-Ass who needs to put down the remote and get off the couch.
 
Posts: 91394
Joined: Thu May 12, 2005 5:51 pm
Location: Oswego, IL

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Мастер » Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:33 pm

Lance wrote:I think the idea of democracy never took large groups of stupid people into account. It's ironic that the majority of the GOP base are the same people most hurt by conservative policies.


I wish I could provide a reference on this one, but I don't think I will be able to find it. But, a little while ago, I came across something (book? article? web page?) that argued the usual claim, that the United States is based on "democracy", was rather inaccurate, and the founders of the country went to considerable lengths to protect people from democracy. The country has become more democratic in some ways since then, e.g., direct election of senators.
They call me Mr Celsius!
User avatar
Мастер
Moderator
Moderator
Злой Мудак
Mauerspecht
 
Posts: 23929
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:56 pm
Location: Far from Damascus

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby MM_Dandy » Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:47 pm

You weren't asking me, but I'll put my two cents in, anyway: they're circus clowns, the lot of 'em. When our primary rolls around, I'll probably vote Carson. In the presidential election, I'll probably vote against Trump or Cruz.
User avatar
MM_Dandy
Moderator
Moderator
King of Obscurity
 
Posts: 4927
Joined: Thu May 12, 2005 9:02 pm
Location: Canton, SD, USA

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Lance » Mon Feb 29, 2016 6:06 pm

MM_Dandy wrote:You weren't asking me, but I'll put my two cents in, anyway: they're circus clowns, the lot of 'em. When our primary rolls around, I'll probably vote Carson. In the presidential election, I'll probably vote against Trump or Cruz.

I'm sorry. I didn't meant to exclude anyone.

But yeah, I'd probably pick Kasich over Carson in the primary but will also vote against whoever the Red* Menace is in November.

*We identify our parties by color for some odd reason. Democrats are blue and Republicans are red. It started some years ago when one of the TV networks started coloring in the states on the map for which party won which state. The colors have stuck ever since.
No trees were killed in the posting of this message.
However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

==========================================

Build a man a fire and he will be warm for a few hours.
Set a man on fire and he will be warm for the rest of his life.
User avatar
Lance
Administrator
Administrator
Cheeseburger Swilling Lard-Ass who needs to put down the remote and get off the couch.
 
Posts: 91394
Joined: Thu May 12, 2005 5:51 pm
Location: Oswego, IL

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Arneb » Mon Feb 29, 2016 6:28 pm

Which is so ironic since the Conservative party in the UK are coloured blue, and Communism alsway was associated with the colour red. But yeah, if the ROW does something one way, you ought to do it differently (the UK used to do this this with daylight saving time: Resetting of the clocks was always a few weeks off the day the Continent did it).

Carson? I must say I got a personal beef with that man because he's from my profession. I've always suspected that evolution-denial by the might is an all-out lie, but to see it in a doctor who HAS to know it's wrong requires an amount of bullet-biting that simply inexcusable.
Non sunt multiplicanda entia praeter necessitatem
User avatar
Arneb
Moderator
Moderator
German Medical Dude
God of All Things IT
 
Posts: 70001
Joined: Thu Nov 23, 2006 8:22 pm
Location: Potsdam, Germany

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby MM_Dandy » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:36 pm

For whatever reason, I don't find Carson's anti-evolutionary (and, by extension, anti-science) stance as off-putting as, say, Jim "thermological" Bolin's, but it is concerning. Kasich seems closer to Cruz on foreign policy than Carson, but Carson isn't exactly espousing acceptance and understanding, either.
User avatar
MM_Dandy
Moderator
Moderator
King of Obscurity
 
Posts: 4927
Joined: Thu May 12, 2005 9:02 pm
Location: Canton, SD, USA

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Enzo » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:16 pm

My own little, probably naive, theory is that we had all these little peripheral players, like Kasich, and the Trump nonsense more or less blew them off the stage in droves. Now that that is over, all of a sudden we are left with Trump, and a bad taste in our mouth. Now of a sudden someone like Kasich starts to look like a viable candidate.

I found it surprising when I opened the Detroit Free Press over the weekend, and found them endorsing Hillary on the democrat side and Kasich on the republican side for the soon to be held primary in Michigan. To be honest, I wasn't sure he was still even running.

When it was just sound bites, Carson was one thing, but once the real campaigning started, the shallowness of his candidacy becomes apparent, and he is fading fast.
E Pluribus Condom
User avatar
Enzo
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
Chortling with glee!
 
Posts: 11956
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2006 5:30 am
Location: Lansing, Michigan

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Heid the Ba » Tue Mar 01, 2016 9:08 am

Arneb wrote:Which is so ironic since the Conservative party in the UK are coloured blue, and Communism alsway was associated with the colour red.

I always have to think that one through, but I usually get donkeys and elephants correct.
Get it up ye.
User avatar
Heid the Ba
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
Tree hugging, veggie, sandal wearing, pinko Euroweasel
Mr. Sexy Ass
 
Posts: 107530
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:20 pm
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Arneb » Tue Mar 01, 2016 9:47 am

Yeah, the animals are quite appropriate.

Maybe Hillary is a viable candidate because she isn't too donkey-ish. We had an article here in our left-leaning news magazine that denigrated her and Bill for redesigingin the Democratic Party into a more centrist GOP (reform of the Penal Code, deregulation of the banking sector...) thus committing treason to true liberal values. Indeed, it seems the GOP now who are in trouble for being too pure.
Non sunt multiplicanda entia praeter necessitatem
User avatar
Arneb
Moderator
Moderator
German Medical Dude
God of All Things IT
 
Posts: 70001
Joined: Thu Nov 23, 2006 8:22 pm
Location: Potsdam, Germany

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Мастер » Tue Mar 01, 2016 12:20 pm

Arneb wrote:Yeah, the animals are quite appropriate.

Maybe Hillary is a viable candidate because she isn't too donkey-ish. We had an article here in our left-leaning news magazine that denigrated her and Bill for redesigingin the Democratic Party into a more centrist GOP (reform of the Penal Code, deregulation of the banking sector...) thus committing treason to true liberal values. Indeed, it seems the GOP now who are in trouble for being too pure.


I used to think that winning parties would become more and more radical, until they started losing, upon which they would have to moderate in order to put together a winning combination again. However, I'm no longer very sure that this conjecture stands up to scrutiny.
They call me Mr Celsius!
User avatar
Мастер
Moderator
Moderator
Злой Мудак
Mauerspecht
 
Posts: 23929
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:56 pm
Location: Far from Damascus

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Heid the Ba » Tue Mar 01, 2016 1:27 pm

In the UK there was a race to the right, as Labour under Blair chased power rather than stuck to any policy. The new man seems radical because he wants to go back to Labour policies of the 1980s, and you know, the name of the party.

[Tedious Scottish aside]In most of Scotland the Labour Party were the footsoldiers of the "No" vote at the referendum as they were the only party with a presence. They are hated with a passion here for selling out and doing the Tories dirty work. I have just seen a couple of Labour supporters campaigning to stay in Europe be roundly abused by the public who made it very clear that while they would vote to stay in it was despite Labour not because of them.[/Tedious Scottish aside]
Get it up ye.
User avatar
Heid the Ba
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
Tree hugging, veggie, sandal wearing, pinko Euroweasel
Mr. Sexy Ass
 
Posts: 107530
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 12:20 pm
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland

Re: The Next U.S. President

Postby Lianachan » Tue Mar 01, 2016 1:49 pm

Heid the Ba' wrote:[Tedious Scottish aside]In most of Scotland the Labour Party were the footsoldiers of the "No" vote at the referendum as they were the only party with a presence. They are hated with a passion here for selling out and doing the Tories dirty work. I have just seen a couple of Labour supporters campaigning to stay in Europe be roundly abused by the public who made it very clear that while they would vote to stay in it was despite Labour not because of them.[/Tedious Scottish aside]

Ha! Excellent!
A-nis bidh fios aig daoine nuair a tha mi a 'mionnachadh aig dhaibh.
User avatar
Lianachan
Enlightened One
Enlightened One
Tits and Nazis though.... Worth investigating
 
Posts: 8742
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 5:12 pm
Location: A' Ghàidhealtachd, Alba

Next

Return to Current Events and Politics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 23 guests

cron