Lianachan wrote:August 8th, 1918 - beginning of the Battle of Amiens, widely regarded as a (the? local expert Heid can advise I'm sure) major turning point that would lead to the end of WW1.
Arneb wrote:It was also teh day of record losses of planes. Around 50 each.
Heid the Ba wrote:Lianachan wrote:August 8th, 1918 - beginning of the Battle of Amiens, widely regarded as a (the? local expert Heid can advise I'm sure) major turning point that would lead to the end of WW1.
Hindenburg described 8th August as "the Black Day of the German Army" since not only were they beaten decisively but many soldiers surrendered or ran away, which was unusual. Amiens was the start of the end as after that the Germans rarely stood and fought the way they had previously and it is at the start of the "Hundred Days" campaign which ended the war. I would argue the turning point came in 1917 when the Germans realised that they couldn't stop British "bite and hold" tactics when they were properly planned and that the defenders were taking as many casualties as the attackers for the first time. Vimy Ridge and Arras in the Spring of 1917 and Messines and even 3rd Ypres* in the autumn were more of a turning point as it made the Germans realise that their army couldn't take another year of defensive battles which was one of the reasons for the Kaiserschlacht in spring 1918 which burned out the German army for good.
Perhaps "an" expert, certainly not "the" expert, the 50 year old book I was sent to review is on Amiens so my opinion carries some weight in some circles.
TL:DR - Eh, sort of.
Edit: I took so long to compose my reply Arneb jumped in first.
*When Gough (pronounced Guff appropriately enough) rushed attacks they failed, when Plumer was allowed to take his time they succeeded, even in the worst of the rain and mud.
Heid the Ba wrote:Arneb wrote:It was also teh day of record losses of planes. Around 50 each.
It must be remembered that air combat was rarely an end in itself but a means of allowing your own reconnaissance planes to overfly enemy lines while preventing theirs from overflying yours. By this stage in the war the RAF were taking daily photos of the German trenches and rear areas and passing those to the artillery to identify targets. Once the battle started the RAF used radios in planes to correct the fall of shot for artillery batteries in real time, with the infantry using signal panels to identify targets and mark their locations. It was astonishingly sophisticated given the equipment available.
Sorry, I can get quite tedious very quickly.
Lianachan wrote:I'm always impressed by the sophistication of the ways people have come up with to do various things, in and out of war, with the levels of technology they had available to them at the time. It's one of the best things about being an archaeologist, that sort of stuff.
Heid the Ba wrote:those are indeed the main experts, with Guy Martin making a late run on the rails.
Heid the Ba wrote:9th August 48 BC – Caesar's Civil War: Battle of Pharsalus: Julius Caesar decisively defeats Pompey at Pharsalus and Pompey flees to Egypt.
Arneb wrote:1918 - 7 new Germans divisions arrive for meat grinding at Amiens. They are rumered to have been greeted, by a batallion of druck Bavarians, what are you war-extenders doing here?
The total number of German POW for the Amiens region alone reaches 24 k.
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