Brexit Delay

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Re: Brexit Delay

Postby Heid the Ba » Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:16 pm

This train's never late. There is a general election in the offing so the PM promises to build ships at Rosyth. Somehow after the election these ships will end up being built in England.
Get it up ye.
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Re: Brexit Delay

Postby Arneb » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:05 pm

Cunning!
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Re: Brexit Delay

Postby Richard A » Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:32 pm

Arneb wrote:Here is one thing I don't get. The opposition in the Commons, including the thrown-out lot from the Tories seems to have a majority of around 330 to 300. Why didn't they

a) put up a motion of no confidence in the current PM
b) declare confidence in a caretaker Prime Minister - a figure of integrity who is guaranteed not to have his or her own ambitions: Kenneth Clarke, Oliver Letwin, Anna Soubry or an old moderate Labour hand past their prime, and ask the Queen to appoint him or her
c) Make a referendum law laying out three options: Do you want
1 the UK to leave the EU on Oct. 31 without further negotiations ("NO-DEAL BREXIT")
2 the UK to leave the European Union on October 31st according to the agreement reached in February 2019 ("GOVERNMENT DEAL BREXIT")
3 the UK to revoke the referendum decision of 2016 and stay in the EU ("NO BREXIT")?
If no option reaches an absolute majority, the two with the most votes run off against each other two weeks later
d) offer the Tories to schedule a genreal election about two or three months after the referendum, so that the current House can bring in the legislation required to put the result of the new referendum in practice.

Apparently, a similar version of this failed because many MPs couldn't imagine voting for Jeremy Corbyn - and I get that. So Labour could say that, for the good of the country we'll even vote for a Tory who has shown they will put the good of the country above their own ambitions. It could have set something in motion.


Very good questions - and pretty much what I have been in favour of for a while. (OK, I hadn't thought through the precise details of (c), but your proposal is a good one.) In fact, (a) would not necessarily have resulted in an immediate election - it should ideally have been followed by (b). But here's the rub. Some in the Labour Party will not contemplate anyone other than Corbyn as caretaker PM - whether or not they cite the constitutional convention (on which they have a point), the real issue is that they will not tolerate anyone who might continue policies such as austerity. Normally they'd be right, but they clearly do not recognise the current emergency and what follows from that. Many others (myself included) would have accepted someone other than Corbyn, particularly as a caretaker PM, but are very wary of someone like Harman (one of Jo Swinson's suggestions) as she might use her position to try to take Labour back to Blairism. I personally thought Ken Clarke a good choice, but others said "no way"! So the real problem with (b) was finding someone who could command a majority. I still think they should have gone for it - following a vote of no confidence, the opposition has 14 days to come up with a credible government and I think that would have been enough for the necessary horse trading. But hey, it's past history now - unless they can pull that rabbit out of the hat as soon as Parliament reconvenes. (And who knows what talks may be going on while Parliament's shut?) Tom Watson is now demanding, pretty much, (c) and (d), but Corbyn is saying no. So we'll see. And it may all be too late now anyway - unless the Supreme Court upholds the Court of Session decision.
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Re: Brexit Delay

Postby Richard A » Fri Sep 13, 2019 12:36 pm

But even now, Leave.EU (Cummings's mates) are attacking the Court of Session judges - digging up controversial decisions of each of the three. Possibly to mobilise "the people" against them, more likely to try to intimidate the Supreme Court. (Who have been called "enemies of the people" before.) Or even more likely both.
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Re: Brexit Delay

Postby Arneb » Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:48 pm

Thanks, Richard.

It all reminds how the last Weimar coalition broke down in 1932 because they were a third of a percent apart in future employee's contributions to general health insurance.
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