Guilty

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Guilty

Postby MM_Dandy » Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:30 pm

Derek Chauvin, who, as a law-enforcement officer, knelt on a man's neck until he was dead was convicted by a jury of his peers today. The charges were 2nd degree murder, 3rd degree murder, and 2nd degree manslaughter. This is not the end of the story, of course. A sentence is yet to be handed down. Chauvin undoubtedly will appeal. People of color are still dying at a disproportional rate at the hands of police. There is a long way to go, but this is a step in the right direction.
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Re: Guilty

Postby Enzo » Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:09 am

Amen.
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Re: Guilty

Postby Мастер » Wed Apr 21, 2021 7:52 am

I did see this bit on the news from the medical guy from Maryland who testified that George Floyd died from a heart condition, not from the guy kneeling on his neck for nine minutes.
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Re: Guilty

Postby Lianachan » Wed Apr 21, 2021 10:07 am

MM_Dandy wrote:There is a long way to go, but this is a step in the right direction.

Unless, of course, he gets 100 hours community service....
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Re: Guilty

Postby Richard A » Wed Apr 21, 2021 11:00 am

That Maryland Medical Examiner apparently has form for trying to get police officers off the hook. Happily he failed this time.

But yes, there will be an appeal. The ground with the most worrying chance of success is that the jury were unduly pressured by the media coverage. Certainly the statement by Rep. Maxine Waters at the weekend that protestors should get "more confrontational" if Chauvin were acquitted was worrying - as the judge himself pointed out. If I were the prosecutor, I would argue in response that there was equal pressure applied by the pro-police lobby - there have been a string of conservative social media posts recently saying "law enforcement, we stand with you even though you can't hear us right now", not to mention a reappearance of their beloved "Comply, Don't Die" meme. But there's no question that Waters should have kept her mouth shut for a few more days.
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Re: Guilty

Postby Мастер » Wed Apr 21, 2021 11:25 am

Richard A wrote:That Maryland Medical Examiner apparently has form for trying to get police officers off the hook. Happily he failed this time.


I'm assuming that the reason they got a Maryland officer was, that's where they found someone willing to testify the "right" way.
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Re: Guilty

Postby Lance » Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:06 pm

His lawyer was in WAY over his head too. Chauvin has a shot on appeal for "Ineffective Assistance of Counsel".
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Re: Guilty

Postby MM_Dandy » Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:07 pm

As far as his sentencing goes, he will be sentenced on the 2nd Degree Murder charge only, which has a maximum term of 40 years. From what I've heard, his sentence will likely be somewhere between 10 and 15 years, and he'll likely serve around 7. Concerning outside influence, I'd argue that various law enforcement officers themselves are threatening to no longer provide service. Of course, that's only a threat to some people, but it's clear what they intend it to be.
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Re: Guilty

Postby Lance » Fri Apr 23, 2021 1:23 pm

There is an "aggravating factors" hearing coming up in a couple of weeks. That could double the sentence. So if the judge follows sentencing guidelines and gives him the 150 months (12 1/2 years), he could end up with 25 years total. He'd end up around 15 years actually served.
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Re: Guilty

Postby Lianachan » Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:32 pm

Of course, this only came about because a 16 year old girl filmed the incident on her phone. Makes you wonder how many other “resisting arrest” people are in jail, or a grave yard, where this sort of thing has gone on undocumented.
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Re: Guilty

Postby Мастер » Fri Apr 23, 2021 4:19 pm

Lianachan wrote:Of course, this only came about because a 16 year old girl filmed the incident on her phone. Makes you wonder how many other “resisting arrest” people are in jail, or a grave yard, where this sort of thing has gone on undocumented.


Well, in other contexts, United Airlines initially claimed that passenger David Dao was being "disruptive" and "belligerent" before they had Chicago airport police beat the living crap out of him. They changed their tune somewhat when video of the incident supported other passengers' story that he was neither disruptive nor belligerent.

Related to the above, many have said the David Dao incident is an example of racism. I'm not so sure about that. I'm as white as they come, and if you think United Airlines wouldn't beat the living crap out of me, I do not share your confidence. That's most of the reason that the last time I was on a United Airlines aeroplane was 2016, despite the fact that I am a million mile flier in their programme with lifetime gold status.

But, back to the original incident, yes, video is keeping the world more honest. I can't find the reference, because a Google search returns so many results I can't find the one I want. But, there was an incident where an American military officer in Vietnam reported numerous civilian deaths. He later saw the report filed higher in the command chain, which reported no civilian deaths and 100% combatant deaths. No video. Oh well.

Anecdotes, so take them for what they're worth. But, someone on the news the other day was commenting that in major US cities, if you look at complaints about police brutality, they are very typically concentrated on a very small subset of the police force. Now, if you are a police officer involved in a situation where you legitimately had to draw your weapon and fire it, injuring or killing someone, to protect yourself or someone else, would you like for there to be a video record of what happened, or would you prefer that there be none?

In a somewhat different context, TSA (US airport security) seems to have quite a track record for "losing" videos of incidents where complaints of mistreatment were made. How unfortunate for them that the video that would have supported their story and shown that their actions were totally appropriate, somehow was lost. You would thing an organisation that gets such bad press would welcome video vindication of their actions, which were totally appropriate. I would think an organisation so frequently falsely accused of bad behaviour would figure out a more reliable way to store the videos that would vindicate them!

But anyway, it's after midnight, I'll put on a few episodes of Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt before going to sleep, and then riding the bicycle to Jurong Bird Bark tomorrow (well, actually, later today).
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Re: Guilty

Postby Richard A » Mon Apr 26, 2021 9:00 pm

And I have to say, I worry for the safety of the girl who took a video of things she wasn't supposed to. As MM Dandy has pointed out, there are those in Minneapolis law enforcement who are less than happy at the prospect of one of their own going to jail. Their failing to show up for work could be the least of it.
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